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 Multiculturalism in Australia

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Veritas

Veritas


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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySun 09 Sep 2018, 10:35 am

Multiculti
has been a failure in Australia for decades and as much as the government tinkers with it, it will never get it right.

here's an O/s example...

‘Sweden’s full’: Migrants turn to right-wing party



  • By Oliver Moody
  • The Times
  • 9:54AM September 8, 2018


Sweden is full. It cannot take any more refugees. Those who are already here should pledge their loyalty to secular Swedish values or lose their benefits. Multiculturalism has failed. It is time to enforce a single “majority culture” instead.


These are an unlikely set of views for a man who was born in Iran and granted asylum by Sweden at the age of five. But Nima Gholam Ali Pour is one of tens of thousands of migrants, and more than a million Swedes, who have turned to a radical right-wing party that is poised to shatter the country’s cosy political consensus.

Today (Sunday) Sweden faces the most tumultuous election in its modern history. Polls indicate that one in five voters will back the Sweden Democrats, a party shunned by the establishment for its white supremacist origins and its ambition to close the borders to all asylum seekers.

After years of being dismissed as cranks and xenophobes, the party will wield the balance of power in one of Europe’s richest nations.


Like many Swedes, Mr Gholam Ali Pour’s journey from centre-left to the populist right was born of frustration at mainstream politicians’ squeamishness about migration.


The 36-year-old former teacher used to belong to the Social Democrats, who have been the country’s largest party for more than a century. In 2013, when he says his local branch in Malmo appointed an Islamist to its governing board, he quit in disgust.

He cast around for a party that would talk frankly about Sweden’s race problems. He found the Sweden Democrats. Within five years he had become their political secretary in Malmo, a city of 340,000 people.

Mr Gholam Ali Pour argues that his party has come a long way since its dark days in the early Nineties. Two successive leaders - the incumbent is Jimmie Akesson, a hipsterish former web designer - have purged the party and tried to fashion it into a respectable electoral force.
“Sure, a lot of people who have racist ideas come into the party,” Mr Gholam Ali Pour said. “But we throw them out. It’s a pain in the arse, them coming in. It’s a lot of work.”
Sweden Democrats no longer talk about ensuring the survival of the white race, at least in public. The blanket condemnation of Islam has disappeared. In its place are centrist, crowd-pleasing pledges such as a boost to health spending.

What is really for sale, though, is nationalism. Even before a record 134,000 asylum seekers came to Sweden in 2015, the country had struggled to digest its immigrants, many of whom are clustered in poor suburbs that have effectively become ghettos.


The most infamous of these is Rosengard, where Mr Gholam Ali Pour spent his first years in Sweden. Only one in 20 children in Rosengard’s primary schools has Swedish parents. Fewer than two out of five adults have jobs. Gang crime and violence are rife. In January two men bombed the police station. A 16-year-old Iraqi boy was shot dead at a bus stop last year.


These troubles are not unique to Rosengard. The murder rate for Malmo as a whole is three times as high as London’s. “Last night (Friday) there was a person who got killed right outside my front door - shot,” said Noria Manouchi, 27, a Swedish-Tunisian city councillor and parliamentary candidate for the centre-right Moderate party who lives in Hermodsdal, a mile to the south of Rosengard.
“That’s a part of everyday life where I live, and has been all my life,” she said. “Politicians have made the wrong priorities for so long that the city is cut in half. It’s very segregated.”
The Sweden Democrats’ clean-up has come at the right time for them to take advantage of these divisions. Why, it argues, should refugees get full social benefits and an easy five-year path to citizenship if they cannot speak Swedish or respect basic norms such as shaking hands with women?

Some, however, are unpersuaded. Arwin Sohrabi, 24, who is campaigning for the Social Democrats, said: “I think a lot of it is on the surface. They realised you can get a lot further in politics if you put on a fancy suit.”

He points out that the number of Malmo residents who depend on social benefits has fallen for three years. School results are improving and unemployment declining.

Five minutes later an Arab woman with a limp and a Syrian flag on her baseball cap approaches the bins behind the Social Democrat cabin. She picks up a discarded Burger King bag, sniffs its contents and stashes it in her jacket.
So long as this other Sweden lurks behind the facade of a prosperous and happy nation, the Sweden Democrats will be here to stay.
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Veritas

Veritas


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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyMon 20 Aug 2018, 2:05 pm

BTW many confuse multi-racial with multi-cultural.
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyMon 20 Aug 2018, 2:05 pm

Time for you to explain the difference then... :)
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DreamRyder

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyMon 20 Aug 2018, 10:20 am

The more I read, the more it seems........people are confusing Multi-Ethnicity with Multi-Culturalism & vice-versa......they are quite different.....& only one of those two will ensure Australia has an enriched future.  
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Neferti
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySat 18 Aug 2018, 3:16 pm

Quote :
Multiculturalism isn’t all it’s cracked up to be

You are not alone if you are worried about our governments’ obsession with multiculturalism. Most people only know it as different foods, different languages and different music (including a quick dance like Zorba the Greek) but they personally not only reject the unpalatable bits that are patently inconsistent with liberal democratic life. They reject the idea that the neighbours who continue with those ancient practices are encouraged by government policies to do so.

Multiculturalism as a political force has been one of the most virulent left-wing ideological infections ever introduced into Australian politics and, like the ignorance on which it feeds, has been resistant to every attempted cure. One of the reasons has been the political influence that whole suburbs of a multicultural can exercise. As infections go, multiculturalism’s spread has been assisted by federal and state governments refusing to rub their hands of it, which have even created special ministries whose sole task is to metaphorically fertilise and water it, to protect that part of our garden in which it has taken root.

You probably noticed that it was the less skilled in the Australian workforce, the ones who live in the outer suburbs, who rejected the multi-million dollar multiculturalism marketing campaigns of the eighties and nineties by the ALP. Pauline Hanson was the first to identify this aspect and she paid a heavy price including gaol time brought on by the sheer vindictiveness. Controlled immigration was never the issue for ordinary Australians. What was disconcerting was uncontrolled immigration with the outright rejection by the left of any integration. Immigrants and refugees were to do their own thing because we are a multicultural society. Not, mind you, a liberal democracy; just a multicultural society.

In fact, just by calling Australia a multicultural society, they demonstrated that they don’t really understand the genie they were happy to let out of the bottle. Most Australians happily accept different cultural features: different foods, different dances, traditional celebrations, music. A culture, however, is much, much more than that. Theoretically, each people’s culture includes every part of their different ways of life: their arts, aesthetics, food, music, habits of life, their sacred beliefs, household management including their customs and taboos within the family structure and abhorrent practices like female genital mutilation.

As each culture is said to embrace the whole lifestyle of a people, that culture implicitly appeals to an authority to which a people look for justice. In Australia, we look to the law for justice and, as the Americans say, we place our faith in the constitution. But in countries from which many people come, the source of the authority for what is just can be anything from a tribal king, a religious figure, men or my cousin with guns, even the oldest family member – to name just a few. To what, then, will these people look for justice when they live in a foreign land where none of those things are present? Without those traditional figures being present, they will assume that there is no law or at least no law applicable to them; thus, the chant to the police a few days ago: “You can’t touch me.”

If you asked where was the authority when South Sudanese youths were rioting in Melbourne a few days ago, the answer would be back in South Sudan. A spokesman for the South Sudanese Federation was reported in The Weekend Australian as saying that it was ‘the kind of thing that most young people do.’ It possibly is in South Sudan (and now in Melbourne). The police spokesman’s explanation implicitly deferred to the government’s cultural sensitivity by citing a “move-on strategy” with no intention to arrest offenders.

That should have opened Victorians eyes about their socialist government’s bias: when a gang of Sudanese youths go on a rampage, trashing property and cars, threatening residents and throwing stones and bottle at police, the Victorian police will ignore it and move them on to do the same thing in another suburb. If a gang of elderly Christian pensioners were to hold a prayer meeting within 150 metres of a Melbourne abortion clinic (AKA legalised domestic violence clinic), they would be arrested, charged and if convicted, ordered to pay a fine they can’t afford and possibly sent to gaol. They would definitely be sent to gaol, however, if they moved on to do it in a different suburb.

The Victorian government has traded on its cultural and diversity sensitivity credentials for so long that it is impotent when confronted by young Sudanese men who are insensitive to the civilising effects of Australian law. The political problem that ‘culture’ and ‘multiculture’ cause is one that originated in the  universities and until that concept has been re-examined in the universities and finally debunked, it will continue to deny governments, if not the power, then the will to act in a practical and just way to both the new arrivals and the rest.

The original meaning of culture is still found in the word, agriculture, where it means cultivation of the soil, the conscious perfection of the soil and its crops in order to realise its natural potential. Culture was always the cultivation of nature, and when applied to human beings, it meant the cultivation of the mind. The current policy of ‘leave them alone to do what they like’ has no beneficial effect either on the new arrivals or the rest of society. Most immigrants come here for a better and more just life, one that only liberal democracy can provide. If they are to be left alone, new arrivals might just as well take matters into their own hands, which is not justice.

The left assumes that the varying cultural practices of different groups are all equal; the culture of those who obey the laws, equal to the culture of those who take to the streets as mob rule.  They might have taken a different course, had they known that the idea of culture, through an eighteenth-century German concept, found its full expression in Nazism.

The Spectator link
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySat 18 Aug 2018, 2:35 pm

93% of Australians in a poll run Australia wide by A Current Affair with 35,000 responses wanted Multiculti abandoned.  Even now a large majority think our immigration numbers are way too big.


Last edited by Veritas on Sat 18 Aug 2018, 4:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySat 18 Aug 2018, 11:18 am

"Ever been to WA in the last 15 years? I doubt it. The Boom has changed the state's population in a big, big, way."

So you agree with me that almost all WA migrants used to come from the UK. goodo...
Unlike you I would not make a comment on a place I have no idea about.
Check out the stats.
YOU continuously say Sydney is different to the rest of Australia, yes it is the largest multicultural centre in the country. We have "Kiwis and Poms" here too ya know.
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Neferti
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySat 18 Aug 2018, 8:24 am

Quote :
Two colours, one family: What life is like when your child looks quite different to you

Ms Gore-Birch is an Aboriginal woman and looks visibly dark skinned, but her children — 19-year-old Quincy-Rae, 18-year-old Scott, 12-year-old Abby, 10-year-old Jacob and 9-year-old Joshua — all have white skin.

She says she has never seen a difference, but others certainly do.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-18/aboriginal-parents-white-children-family-different-skin-colours/10107600

Really?  They all look aboriginal to me.

Multiculturalism in Australia Cissy10

On the other hand, same story from ABC. This family.

Multiculturalism in Australia Mala10

Yes, there is a difference here. Laughing
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyFri 17 Aug 2018, 10:30 pm

Rubbish re the Multicultural claim. Anyone looking at the numbers and stats prove that.
Sydney is a city, the largest in Australia. Immigrants flock there, Sydney not being a living entity has no choice about that at all.
I suggest since you "rarely" and only "visit" there you stick to commenting on places you actually know about.
Your comment re the "North Shore" just exposes your lack of knowledge about Sydney and NSW and its government.
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyFri 17 Aug 2018, 2:14 pm

Kattaning is as Multicultural as anywhere in Oz. You can claim otherwise but the reality is that most of Sydney's problems are Sydney's making, no one elses. Outside of Australia, Multiculturalism is accepted. Inside, Sydney? I have no idea as I rarely visit that city. Perhaps the Government of NSW needs to stop thinking that "Australia" stops at the North Shore? Tsk, tsk.
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyFri 17 Aug 2018, 9:30 am

WA has never been very Multicultural at all in fact most migrants at one stage came from the UK.

I hardly think NZ and UK in your figures represent a different culture coming there.
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Neferti
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyFri 17 Aug 2018, 8:02 am

brian ross wrote:
Neferti wrote:
brian ross wrote:
The towns where multiculturalism works, built on a foundation of tolerance
Which towns are those, Brian? Can you cite an example where there are Aussies, Indians, Middle Eastern, Chinese, Vietnamese, Italians and Greeks all living together and speaking to each other in Pidgin English and still living a Happy Life without Welfare?

Read the link I have provided:  

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-16/towns-where-multiculturalism-works-built-on-tolerance/10123058

I suggest that whomever is the Admin here should change the link colour to make it more obvious.

Firstly, I am the Admin here. This is my Forum.

Secondly, you should check the Census information for the town of Katanning, WA mentioned in your ABC link.

The population of Katanning in 2016 (Census) was 3,687 and of that 64% (2,347) were born in Australia. Those born overseas were from:

Myanmar (154)
New Zealand (135)
England (93)
Thailand (72)
Afghanistan (66)

More information at the link below:

http://quickstats.censusdata.abs.gov.au/census_services/getproduct/census/2016/quickstat/SSC50736

Very "multicultural" wot?
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyThu 16 Aug 2018, 6:18 pm

Neferti wrote:
brian ross wrote:
The towns where multiculturalism works, built on a foundation of tolerance
Which towns are those, Brian? Can you cite an example where there are Aussies, Indians, Middle Eastern, Chinese, Vietnamese, Italians and Greeks all living together and speaking to each other in Pidgin English and still living a Happy Life without Welfare?

Read the link I have provided:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-16/towns-where-multiculturalism-works-built-on-tolerance/10123058

I suggest that whomever is the Admin here should change the link colour to make it more obvious.
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Neferti
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyThu 16 Aug 2018, 4:45 pm

brian ross wrote:
The towns where multiculturalism works, built on a foundation of tolerance
Which towns are those, Brian? Can you cite an example where there are Aussies, Indians, Middle Eastern, Chinese, Vietnamese, Italians and Greeks all living together and speaking to each other in Pidgin English and still living a Happy Life without Welfare?
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyThu 16 Aug 2018, 4:37 pm

The towns where multiculturalism works, built on a foundation of tolerance
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DreamRyder

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyThu 16 Aug 2018, 10:04 am

There are but Three (3) conditions that face a Refugee arriving as a potential permanent resident in a new land.

◈  Assimilation

◈  Integration

◈  Departure

If either of the first two are not accepted, the third is unavoidable.

A Nation can bask in it's Ethnic Diversity, but it will eventually perish under the extremes of Multiculturalism.....
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyThu 16 Aug 2018, 9:07 am

"Too many" have amnesia according to you.  Do you honestly think that is factual.
Both major parties are responsible for our Refugee treatment, not the populous at large.

The "overwhelming majority"  of immigrants are not Refugees.

"We" as a society do not in fact "welcome them".  "We" have no say in their numbers or where they come from.  But Australians are tolerant and fair minded by nature, and our culture and society has tended to be laid-back and accepting.

"We" do not have the racial problems of a USA or speak in colours.  "We" do not have the problems of a British class system.

Under Multiculturalism they do not have to become Australian at all.  How do you think they achieve that?  Just by living here?  Gaining a citizenship certificate perhaps?  Is that truly what you think makes one Australian?

As for the insult and lie about me "condemning them wholesale" just where have I done that.  Do not flame me or lie about me.  I come here to discuss issues etc, not tolerate TROLLS.
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyWed 15 Aug 2018, 10:01 pm

Refugees come here to seek shelter. We provide it because we, as a society are merciful. Something too many forget. Refugees are a tiny minority in the total number of immigrants that we accept. The overwhelming majority if immigrants are law abiding, well behaved, rational individuals who just want a better life for themselves and their families. Something that is all too often forgotten in this whole "debate". They just want to be allowed to live here. We, as a society welcome them. Doesn't matter what the colour of their skin is, what their culture is, what their beliefs are - they have decided to become Australian. Something you need to remember before you decide to condemn them wholesale the way you do, in post after post. Tsk, tsk.
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyWed 15 Aug 2018, 9:56 pm

The Host culture is the HOST....  we are hosting them.
Allowing them to come here.
Many Refugees do not wish to stay here and seek only to stay here until a problem at "home" is resolved.

Therefore centering a discussion on refugees, which are a minority at the best of times in immigration numbers, when the topic is Multiculturalism is largely moot.

As for Integration etc being a mutual consent/agreement issue.  It totally is...  if migrants do not wish to be Australians then why come here in the first place?

Calling a society intolerant and facist is problematic and wrong. These are individual traits.


Last edited by Veritas on Thu 16 Aug 2018, 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyWed 15 Aug 2018, 9:45 pm

Assimilation/Integration has to occur equally from both the migrants and the host culture. Assimilation/Integration has to be flexible and on the terms of both the migrant and the hosts. Trying to enforce "integration" and make migrants conform is pointless. It will not work. There must be mutual agreement over the issue, there must be acceptance and tolerance. Otherwise you end up with a fascist intolerant society
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyWed 15 Aug 2018, 7:55 pm

By integration are we talking about Refugees joining the welfare queue?

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/refugees-on-welfare-the-real-numbers
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyWed 15 Aug 2018, 7:50 pm

Refugees are a small portion of total migrant numbers.
A great many don't Integrate.
They don't have to integrate, we have Multiculturalism.
We used to have Integration and before that Assimilation.  
Many during those times even resisted that.


Last edited by Veritas on Wed 15 Aug 2018, 7:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Neferti
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySat 28 Jul 2018, 8:26 am

DreamRyder wrote:
When new peoples come to a new land they have to learn new methods for dealing with interactions.

★ They must communicate.

★ They must know the Law

★ They must find an occupation

As far as I can see, the type of Multiculturalism I have seen does not & can not benefit individuals in a large society. You end up with ghettos aside ghettos, aside ghettos, each with large differences, areas of contention, & where these ghettos do interact, there is a high likelihood of misunderstandings & resentment. Nationally, this could also pose grave problems, especially with governing, & establishing programs for the common good.

Therefore, I see assimilation as the only viable way for newcomers to form & become an integral part of a greater National identity, & with it blend/incorporate into an existing local society, for the benefit of the greater National Society.

ASSIMILATION is the only way to go.
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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptyFri 27 Jul 2018, 10:09 pm

When new peoples come to a new land they have to learn new methods for dealing with interactions.

★ They must communicate.

That means understanding a common language. If the Country they have just migrated to has been around for quite a while, then a common language has probably already been established. It would be incumbent upon the new entrant(s) to learn the established language. They can always use the "old" language amongst their own family unit, but to be successful at learning a new language, the "new" language should replace the "old" as soon as the family members are proficient enough to communicate well enough amongst themselves with it.

★ They must know the Law

Knowing the local law is imperative, & even though most laws will, in general, be similar, knowing exactly what can & can't be done in their new surroundings is an absolute must. Most societies have very little tolerance of people "accidentally" breaking laws out of ignorance.

★ They must find an occupation

Finding work can help a newcomer in many ways beside providing an income to support themselves & their family. They will interact with their fellow workers, so their language skills will benefit, & what they learn they can bring home & share with their family & friends. They can, through social communications, help others sharing what they know, & at the same time also learning from others through their experiences.

Feigning from interaction only causes a social group to cut off from others around them, causing numerous problems, & retarding their own growth in their new "home".

As far as I can see, the type of Multiculturalism I have seen does not & can not benefit individuals in a large society. You end up with ghettos aside ghettos, aside ghettos, each with large differences, areas of contention, & where these ghettos do interact, there is a high likelihood of misunderstandings & resentment. Nationally, this could also pose grave problems, especially with governing, & establishing programs for the common good.

Therefore, I see assimilation as the only viable way for newcomers to form & become an integral part of a greater National identity, & with it blend/incorporate into an existing local society, for the benefit of the greater National Society.
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Veritas

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PostSubject: Re: Multiculturalism in Australia   Multiculturalism in Australia EmptySun 22 Jul 2018, 1:53 pm

The following comment was censored by THe Australian from their comments section.
It broke no rules...

Well Alan let me tell you, Multiculti is a failure. It is a fraud, a burden, set upon us by a handful of social engineers using the Australian society as their experiment. How many times were we asked if we wanted this policy? Not once. Even the new Australians at the time didn't want it introduced.
We had Assimilation. Where people were expected to become Australians. Just how would they have forgotten where they came from etc, is beyond me. That was never an expectation.
We had Integration. But apparently that wasn't enough. But now you are talking about Integration. You know some people still think Multiculti involves Assimilation... that people think it is just a stepping stone to Assimilation. But hey, you and I both know Assimilation is not the goal or outcome of Multiculti, and it and Integration is not a requirement.
How many times has Multiculturalism been tweaked and fiddled with since its inception? The answer is many, yet still it doesn't work. It doesn't matter that you and Turnbull like saying its a great success etc, etc, but the people at the Multiculti coal-face know the truth. You cannot have a united country and society if its based on division and Multiculturalism in Australia is Cultural Apartheid. Count the enclaves Alan.
The world's largest study on diversity policy showed that it disrupts social harmony and creates isolationism within societies. Not exactly something I think we want.
If you want to be selective about who we let come to Australia, then instead of discriminating on a skills level, we should be looking to people that will fit in with our society and our values. You know as well as I do that both major parties have failed in doing this for quite a while now. Fear of being labelled racist looms large doesn't it? Well I fear for the future of our country. Which was IMO the most egalitarian in the world. A place to be proud of, not suffer the cultural cringe of elitist progressives. Who BTW infest both the major parties.
It is long past time that Multiculturalism was abandoned. Those unhappy about that are welcome to leave and find their place elsewhere in the world. But I can assure you those that love us and our way of life will want to stay. Those are the people we need.
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